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The following post may seem long, but I really appreciate feedback and advice about what I am sure is a common dilemma in this community.
My best friend and I have done some hoop performances together, and have always split the $$$ 50-50. However, she recently told me that she wants to change our arrangement. She wants what she called a "standard finder's fee", whereby the hooper who actually gets the gig (thru promoting and networking) takes 60% of the money, and the other one of us would get 40%...the thing that really bothers me, however, is that she also wants the hooper who got the gig (and gets 60%) to have what she called "exclusive promotion rights" that night, meaning: that if she gets the gig, she gets 60% of the $$$ AND the "right" to handout her card, whereas I would not be able to hand out my card that night. (and vice versa)
Now, this girl is my best friend and I love her, so we both agreed to sit down and lay out our sides of it. Here are my problems with what she is saying:
-the money should be split equally if we are doing equal work
-as for the cards, we should both hand out our cards, anytime anywhere. this is especially true b/c I am the only one out of the two of us who makes and sells hoops (she never has, and I made her hoops for her). When i asked her how she would handle someone approaching her for a hoop order, she suggested that she would pass the order on to me, and then TAKE A CUT of the hoop money. i am NOT cool with this as it is my materials and labor at work. also, i ordered professional cards long ago, whereas she only made hers last week on the computer, and i also am the only one of us who maintains a hooping website for my business.
-though she is a great hooper with her own style and all, I have put much more into my hooping so far in the sense that I have: travelled to NC TWICE for hooping retreats and to learn from the best, i have been making all types of hoops for months (including LED ones for her and I!), I have gone into NYC for classes, etc etc....I am also planning to do a teacher training asap. She, though great, has only hooped and studied with me, and performed a couple of times with me.
The true irony in this is that, we haven't even made enough money to be squabbling over it! We have made less than $100 collectively from gigs! I make more money from hoop making, which is my work alone. I think, b/c she has not studied with the "greats" as I have, she does not really realize yet how far we have yet to go, and what novices we really are (I hooped for 6 months, she for 4 or 5).
Ultimately, I am thinking that for the sake of the friendship we should go our own separate ways when it come to hooping and anything revolving around $$$$$. Though I don't WANT to be competitors, I cannot agree to the arrangements she has suggested. She seems to want very much to profit from hooping, and i have slightly different goals. Sure, money is great, but i don't want any negative energy creating blocks on my hoop path. i think it may be time for our hoop paths, but not our friendship paths, to diverge.
Any feedback is WAY appreciated!
My best friend and I have done some hoop performances together, and have always split the $$$ 50-50. However, she recently told me that she wants to change our arrangement. She wants what she called a "standard finder's fee", whereby the hooper who actually gets the gig (thru promoting and networking) takes 60% of the money, and the other one of us would get 40%...the thing that really bothers me, however, is that she also wants the hooper who got the gig (and gets 60%) to have what she called "exclusive promotion rights" that night, meaning: that if she gets the gig, she gets 60% of the $$$ AND the "right" to handout her card, whereas I would not be able to hand out my card that night. (and vice versa)
Now, this girl is my best friend and I love her, so we both agreed to sit down and lay out our sides of it. Here are my problems with what she is saying:
-the money should be split equally if we are doing equal work
-as for the cards, we should both hand out our cards, anytime anywhere. this is especially true b/c I am the only one out of the two of us who makes and sells hoops (she never has, and I made her hoops for her). When i asked her how she would handle someone approaching her for a hoop order, she suggested that she would pass the order on to me, and then TAKE A CUT of the hoop money. i am NOT cool with this as it is my materials and labor at work. also, i ordered professional cards long ago, whereas she only made hers last week on the computer, and i also am the only one of us who maintains a hooping website for my business.
-though she is a great hooper with her own style and all, I have put much more into my hooping so far in the sense that I have: travelled to NC TWICE for hooping retreats and to learn from the best, i have been making all types of hoops for months (including LED ones for her and I!), I have gone into NYC for classes, etc etc....I am also planning to do a teacher training asap. She, though great, has only hooped and studied with me, and performed a couple of times with me.
The true irony in this is that, we haven't even made enough money to be squabbling over it! We have made less than $100 collectively from gigs! I make more money from hoop making, which is my work alone. I think, b/c she has not studied with the "greats" as I have, she does not really realize yet how far we have yet to go, and what novices we really are (I hooped for 6 months, she for 4 or 5).
Ultimately, I am thinking that for the sake of the friendship we should go our own separate ways when it come to hooping and anything revolving around $$$$$. Though I don't WANT to be competitors, I cannot agree to the arrangements she has suggested. She seems to want very much to profit from hooping, and i have slightly different goals. Sure, money is great, but i don't want any negative energy creating blocks on my hoop path. i think it may be time for our hoop paths, but not our friendship paths, to diverge.
Any feedback is WAY appreciated!
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Re: Help: Balancing $$$$$$ and Friendship
Sat, August 1, 2009 - 8:09 AMSad situation...nothing will destroy a friendship faster than $. Unless you are prepared to accept your friend's new rules, it would seem time to go out on your own and try to remain friends....and that might even be challenging.....but if it were me, the message is clear....time tp break away. Hope it works out:-) -
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Re: Help: Balancing $$$$$$ and Friendship
Sat, August 1, 2009 - 8:34 AMPromoting and networking is a lot of work! I don't think asking for 60% is out of line. As for the exclusive promotion rights that seems a bit much and taking a cut of your hoop money is ridiculas!
What ever you do keep it fun, thats what it is all about! -
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Re: Help: Balancing $$$$$$ and Friendship
Tue, November 3, 2009 - 1:49 AMI'd agree that the 60-40 dynamic for whoever booked the gig is pretty appropriate (booking/networking is often more valuable than the performance art itself), but both of you should always get to promote yourselves, and she should not benefit financially from Your hoop-making, regardless of whether or not she helped you with a little promotion, simply because she's your friend and you've clearly done quite a bit for her! Not every action between the two of you has a price tag, even when it does involve hooping.
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Re: Help: Balancing $$$$$$ and Friendship
Sat, August 1, 2009 - 2:06 PMAdrienne,
I don't know where your friend got her ideas, but they were from some source that promotes a competitive biz model over a co-operative biz model. Such competition can be a good thing, especially in certain circumstances, but....
Personally, I prefer a co-operative approach.
I should point out that I make my living as a self-employed musician. Yes, I compete in a free market of goods, services, & ideas, but when I ONLY competed, I barely got by. As soon as I opened up my strategy to others - using a co-operative biz model rather than a competitive model - I became very successful.
"Success" can be defined a variety of ways, but I'm happy, I always make my mortgage payment on time, I drive a cool car, I take care of my family, and - most important for this discussion - I fully employ 2 engineers in my recording studio and 6 instructors in my instructor network using my co-operative model, and they are now successful enough that over 1/2 (so far) have quit their day jobs.
Co-operation trumps competition at every turn....and you can take that to the bank. Literally.
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Re: Help: Balancing $$$$$$ and Friendship
Sun, August 2, 2009 - 1:51 PMwelcome to show biz.
Non competition clauses are so old, they've been banned in California since 1860.
But I still get contracts with the same request-
don't self promote over the booking person.
It's a common courtesy among professional jugglers,
who share gigs with each other
to kick back a 10% finders fee
or $50, whichever is more
to the referrer.
If the $$$ are worth more than working together,
go solo.
If you've been making enough work for your group,
it shouldn't be hard to do.
If you haven't been drumming up work for the two of you,
then it'll be rough.
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Re: Help: Balancing $$$$$$ and Friendship
Fri, October 30, 2009 - 9:58 AMWow. I feel like I just read about the last few months of my life. My best friend and I were trying to do more or less the same thing. We ended up splitting up as business partners and we are no longer even friends. We went from spending every day together and hooping all of the time to not even speaking. I think that mixing money and friends is a bad idea. :( -
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Re: Help: Balancing $$$$$$ and Friendship
Mon, November 9, 2009 - 6:40 PM> I think that mixing money and friends is a bad idea. :( <
It is, if you don't both have an understanding of what's going on, and how things work.
Go Google cooperative business models, and then competitive business models. I haven't even looked, but you should.
=Eric
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